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| | == Links to check == | | == Links to check == |
| − | {{Main Page}} | + | {{Set off quote 1 |
| − | {{Navigation:Brigham Young}}
| + | |color=eaf9f5 |
| − | | + | |image=Russell_nelson_official_portrait_2018.jpeg |
| − | = Did Brigham Young state "I have never given counsel that is wrong"? =
| + | |I believe that if the Lord were speaking to you directly tonight, the first thing He would make sure you understand is your true identity. My dear friends, you are literally spirit children of God. ... |
| − | == A blogger fakes a quote from Brigham Young ==
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| − | The following fabricated quote has gained circulation on the web. The introductory phrase "I have never given counsel that is wrong" was indeed given by Brigham Young. (See: {{JDfairwiki|vol=16|disc=22|start=161}}) Unfortunately for those who wish to rely on it to score political or ideological points, the paragraph that follows is a complete fabrication:
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| − | <blockquote>
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| − | <font color="FF0000">I have never given council that is wrong.</font> <font color="FF0000">I am a Prophet of God in this dispensation.</font> <font color="99FF33">I carry on the work that began with Joseph Smith.</font> <font color="33FFFF">I led the Saints to the barren Salt Lake Valley and it is where we built Zion, even though Joseph Smith taught the Savior would return in Jackson County Missouri.</font> <font color="66B2FF">Monogamous marriage is not the order of heaven, for it is only through polygamy that a man may achieve exaltation.</font> <font color="6666FF">The government should stay out of the lives of the Saints and let us worship and practice our religion according to the dictates of our own conscience.</font> <font color="B266FF">If there ever comes a day when the Saints interfere with the rights of others to live as they see fit, you can know with assurance that the Church is no longer led by a Prophet, but a mere man.</font> <font color="FF66FF">The doctrines of this Church are eternal, for they were ordained before the world was and any man who changes these doctrines such as the temple ceremony, or the man who abandons polygamy, or allows blacks the Priesthood of God, is a fallen prophet.</font>
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| − | I am Brother Brigham. And <font color="FF66B2">I am the voice of God.</font>
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| − | </blockquote>
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| − | Ex-Mormon critics of the Church became excited about the quote and attempted to verify its source because it represented "an astounding batch of ammo if it is a true quote from B[righam] Y[oung]."<ref>Comment posted on the "Recovery from Mormonism" board by "MJ," October 07, 2010.</ref> On a different ex-Mormon board, one poster states that "I really, really want to post this quote tonight on my facebook wall, but I still am looking for a source," and that he "would really love for this quote to be a real B.Y. quote."<ref>Comments posted on "PostMormon.org" by "MyWife'sHusband," September 12, 2009.</ref>
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| − | We examine here the individual elements of the fabricated quote and provide responses to it.
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| − | {{BrighamClaim
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| − | |claim =FF0000
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| − | |colorA=FF0000
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| − | |colorB=
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| − | "I have never given council that is wrong."
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| − | |realquote =
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| − | XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
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| − | |response=Brigham's actual statement is at odds with the fabricated statement. | |
| − | }}
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| − | | |
| − | {{BrighamClaim
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| − | |colorA=FF8000
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| − | |colorB=FF8000 | |
| − | |claim =
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| − | "I am a Prophet of God in this dispensation."
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| − | |realquote =
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| − | "I have never particularly desired any man to testify publicly that I am a Prophet; nevertheless, if any man feels joy, in doing this, he shall be blest in it. I have never said that I am not a Prophet; but, if I am not, one thing is certain, I have been very profitable to this people."<ref>{{JDfairwiki|vol=10|disc=62|start=339}}</ref>
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| − | |response=Brigham's actual statement is at odds with the fabricated statement.
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| − | }}
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| − | | |
| − | {{BrighamClaim
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| − | |colorA=99FF33
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| − | |colorB=99FF33
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| − | |claim =
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| − | "I carry on the work that began with Joseph Smith. "
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| − | |realquote =
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| − | "to carry on the work of God..." <ref>{{JDfairwiki|vol=1|disc=12|start=75}}</ref>
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| − | |response =
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| − | *Brigham talks of carrying on the work of God, not the work of Joseph Smith.
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| − | *This is an attempt by the author of the quote to imply that Joseph Smith is more important to Latter-day Saints than God.
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| − | *{{Detail|Joseph Smith/Status in LDS belief}}
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| − | }}
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| − | {{BrighamClaim
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| − | |colorA=33FFFF
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| − | |colorB=33FFFF
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| − | |claim =
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| − | "I led the Saints to the barren Salt Lake Valley and it is where we built Zion, even though Joseph Smith taught the Savior would return in Jackson County Missouri."
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| − | |response =
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| − | *This is an attempt to imply that if Brigham were a true prophet, then the Saints would never have had to leave "Zion" in Jackson County.
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| − | *While recounting Jim Bridger's negative assessment of the farming potential of the Salt Lake Valley, Brigham Young would not have referred to the Salt Lake Valley as "barren" in this way. A small detail, but indicative of the author's tone and approach.
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| − | *Brigham Young would not have drawn attention to the failure to establish Zion in Jackson County in this way. There is actually a very extensive body of discussion of this in the [[Journal of Discourses]].
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| − | *Brigham never refers to the "barren Salt Lake Valley."
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| − | *{{Detail|Joseph Smith/Prophecies/Independence temple to be built "in this generation"}}
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| − | }}
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| − | {{BrighamClaim
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| − | |colorA=66B2FF
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| − | |colorB=66B2FF
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| − | |claim =
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| − | "Monogamous marriage is not the order of heaven, for it is only through polygamy that a man may achieve exaltation."
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| − | |realquote =
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| − | "The only men who become Gods, even the sons of God, are those who enter into polygamy"<ref>{{JDfairwiki|vol=11|disc=41|start=269}}</ref>
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| − | |response =
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| − | *While there are statements to the effect that plural marriage is a requirement for exaltation for those commanded to live it, Brigham Young would not have stated that priesthood-sealed "monogamous marriage is not the order of heaven."
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| − | *The author seeks to drive a wedge between pre and post-Manifesto Latter-day Saints, but he needs to completely manufacture quotes from Brigham Young in order to do it.
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| − | *{{Detail|Polygamy/The only men who become gods are those that practice polygamy}}
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| − | }}
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| − | | |
| − | {{BrighamClaim
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| − | |colorA=6666FF
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| − | |colorB=6666FF
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| − | |claim =
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| − | "The government should stay out of the lives of the Saints and let us worship and practice our religion according to the dictates of our own conscience."
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| − | |response =
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| − | *Brigham never made a statement like this, but other Church leaders have made statements to this effect:
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| − | **John Taylor: "[T]here is no law, human or divine, that can rightful[l]y rob us of those liberties or trample upon our rights. We have a right to worship God according to the dictates of our own conscience; and no man, legally, in this land, has a right to interfere with us for so doing." ({{JDfairwiki|vol=5|disc=31|start=182}})
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| − | **Orson Pratt: "If we do not transgress the law, then let us be free, like any other American citizens, and let us worship God according to the dictates of our own conscience."<ref>{{JDfairwiki|vol=7|disc=34|start=225}}</ref>
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| − | **George Q. Cannon: "[T]o take our flight as best we could in our poverty to some remote land where we could worship God according to the dictates of our own conscience in peace and in quietness."<ref>{{JDfairwiki|vol=26|disc=30|start=285}}</ref>
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| − | *{{Detail|Joseph Smith/Prophecies/Government to be overthrown and wasted}}
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| − | }}
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| − | | |
| − | {{BrighamClaim
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| − | |colorA=B266FF
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| − | |colorB=B266FF
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| − | |claim =
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| − | "If there ever comes a day when the Saints interfere with the rights of others to live as they see fit, you can know with assurance that the Church is no longer led by a Prophet, but a mere man."
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| − | |response =
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| − | *This is an obvious allusion to California Proposition 8 and Utah Proposition 2. The author of the fake quote is seeking to punish the Church for its stance on gay marriage and the legalization of marijuana.
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| − | *Aside from the fact that nobody believes Brigham Young actually said this (cf. the inquiries from post-Mormon sites asking for references), the irony of using "Brother Brigham" to chastize the modern Church on homosexuality is striking.
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| − | *The phrase "mere man" does not appear in the 26 volumes of the [[Journal of Discourses]]
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| − | *The phrase "mere man" appears only once in the {{MAfairwiki|vol=2|num=5|start=270}}, but it is not used by Brigham Young.
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| − | *{{Detail|Mormonism and politics/California Proposition 8}}
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| − | }}
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| − | | |
| − | {{BrighamClaim
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| − | |colorA=FF66FF
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| − | |colorB=FF66FF
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| − | |claim =
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| − | "The doctrines of this Church are eternal, for they were ordained before the world was and any man who changes these doctrines such as the temple ceremony, or the man who abandons polygamy, or allows blacks the Priesthood of God, is a fallen prophet."
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| − | |response =
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| − | *Brigham never said any of this. The author of the fabricated quote simply wishes to imply that the Church should never change its doctrine or policies.
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| − | *The specific listing of changes in the temple ceremony, polygamy, and the priesthood ban show what the author thinks are the "money" issues that can demonstrate false or fallen prophethood. Brigham was actually very detailed about the parameters of change and knowing we are truly led by God-inspired leaders, despite changes and tough issues.
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| − | *{{Detail|Church doctrine/Changing}}
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| − | *{{Detail|Temples/Endowment/Changes}}
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| − | *{{Detail|Mormonism and racial issues/Blacks and the priesthood}}
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| − | }}
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| − | | |
| − | {{BrighamClaim
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| − | |colorA=FF66B2
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| − | |colorB=FF66B2
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| − | |claim =
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| − | "I am the voice of God"
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| − | |response =
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| − | *This fabricated quote is based upon another fabricated quote from the movie [[Specific works/September Dawn|September Dawn]]. In September Dawn, a movie about the Mountain Meadows Massacre, an actor portraying Brigham says, ""I am the voice of God and anyone who doesn't like it will be hewn down. God has revealed to me that I have the right and the power to call down curses on anyone who tries to invade our lands. Therefore, I curse the gentiles." This quote is fabricated—Brigham never said this.
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| − | }}
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| − | = Did Brigham Young say "I am the voice of God and anyone who doesn't like it will be hewn down"? =
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| − | == FAIR has been unable to find a legitimate source for this purported quotation from Brigham Young ==
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| − | | |
| − | The movie [[Specific works/September Dawn|September Dawn]] claims that Brigham Young made the following statement:
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| − | <blockquote>
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| − | I am the voice of God and anyone who doesn't like it will be hewn down. God has revealed to me that I have the right and the power to call down curses on anyone who tries to invade our lands. Therefore, I curse the gentiles.
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| − | </blockquote>
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| − | FAIR has been unable to find a legitimate source for this purported quotation from Brigham Young. The words are spoken by an actor portraying Brigham Young in the movie September Dawn, an account of the Mountain Meadows massacre. This exact statement has not been attributed to a known source, and may be a paraphrase of a statement made by Young on March 2, 1856:
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| − | <blockquote>
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| − | "The time is coming when justice will be laid to the line and righteousness to the plummet; when we shall take the old broad sword and ask, "Are you for God?" and if you are not heartily on the Lord's side, you will be hewn down." ({{JDfairwiki|vol=3|disc=30|start=226}})
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| − | </blockquote>
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| − | == The "I am a prophet of God" fake quote is a conflation of things that Brigham discussed, with a negative spin ==
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| − | == Here is the real "I have never given counsel that is wrong" quote ==
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| − | | |
| − | Here is what Brigham actually said:
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| − | <blockquote>
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| − | I am here to give this people, called Latter-day Saints, counsel to direct them in the path of life. I am here to answer; I shall be on hand to answer when I am called upon, for all the counsel and for all the instruction that I have given to this people. If there is an Elder here, or any member of this Church, called the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, who can bring up the first idea, the first sentence that I have delivered to the people as counsel that is wrong, I really wish they would do it; but they cannot do it, for the simple reason that <span style="color:blue">I have never given counsel that is wrong</span>; this is the reason. This people, called Latter-day Saints, have been laboring now over forty years. <ref>{{JDfairwiki|vol=16|disc=22|start=161}}</ref>
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| − | </blockquote>
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| − | = Did Brigham Young say "I am the voice of God and anyone who doesn't like it will be hewn down"? =
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| − | == FAIR has been unable to find a legitimate source for this purported quotation from Brigham Young ==
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| − | | |
| − | The movie [[Specific works/September Dawn|September Dawn]] claims that Brigham Young made the following statement:
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| − | | |
| − | <blockquote>
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| − | I am the voice of God and anyone who doesn't like it will be hewn down. God has revealed to me that I have the right and the power to call down curses on anyone who tries to invade our lands. Therefore, I curse the gentiles.
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| − | </blockquote>
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| − | | |
| − | FAIR has been unable to find a legitimate source for this purported quotation from Brigham Young. The words are spoken by an actor portraying Brigham Young in the movie September Dawn, an account of the Mountain Meadows massacre. This exact statement has not been attributed to a known source, and may be a paraphrase of a statement made by Young on March 2, 1856:
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| − | <blockquote>
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| − | "The time is coming when justice will be laid to the line and righteousness to the plummet; when we shall take the old broad sword and ask, "Are you for God?" and if you are not heartily on the Lord's side, you will be hewn down." ({{JDfairwiki|vol=3|disc=30|start=226}})
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| − | </blockquote>
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| − | | |
| − | = Did Brigham say "We shall pull the wool over the eyes of the American people"? =
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| − | == As far as we can determine, this quotation is a complete fabrication ==
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| − | It is rumored that Brigham Young made the following statement:
| + | Labels ''can'' be fun and indicate your support for any number of positive things. Many labels will change for you with the passage of time. And not all labels are of equal value. But if any label replaces your most important identifiers, the results can be spiritually suffocating. ... |
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| − | <blockquote>
| + | ''Who are you?'' First and foremost, you are a child of God. |
| − | We shall pull the wool over the eyes of the American people and make them swallow Mormonism, polygamy and all."
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| − | </blockquote>
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| − | Critics say this shows the fundamental dishonesty of LDS leaders. <ref>{{CriticalWork:Abanes:One Nation|pages=281}}. (Source ''Proceedings Before The Committee...''); Ambrose B. Carlton, ''The Wonderlands of the Wild West, with Sketches of the Mormons'' (N.p.: n.p., 1891), 321.; {{CriticalWork:Erickson:As a Thief in the Night|pages=chapter 8, footnote 118}}; E.A. Folk (editor of the ''Baptist and Reflector''), ''Story of Mormonism'' citing discourse of 12 July 1875 in Salt Lake Tabernacle.; Brigham Young, quoted in ''Proceedings Before The Committee On Privileges And Elections Of The United States Senate In The Matter Of The Protests Against The Right Of Hon. Reed Smoot, A Senator From Utah, To Hold His Seat'', 4 vols. (Washington, D.C.: Government Printing Office, 1906), 1:15; citing as source E.A. Folk as above.</ref>
| + | Second, as a member of the Church, you are a child of the covenant. And third, you are a disciple of Jesus Christ. |
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| − | As far as we can determine, this quotation is a complete fabrication. We cannot locate it in any LDS source, and those non-LDS sources who provide a reference are in error.
| + | Tonight, I plead with you not to ''replace'' these three paramount and unchanging identifiers with any others, because doing so could stymie your progress or pigeonhole you in a stereotype that could potentially thwart your eternal progression. |
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| − | If any reader has further information, please [http://fairlds.org/contact.php contact us]. At present, however, the best assumption seems to be that the quote is a fabrication.
| + | For example, if you are identified mainly as an American, those who are not Americans may think, “I know everything there is to know about you” and attribute erroneous beliefs to you. |
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| − | FAIR has been unable to find a legitimate source for this purported quotation from Brigham Young. It was quoted at the Reed Smoot hearing report, but the source is only given as E.A. Folk, editor of the ''Baptist and Reflector'', a Nashville, Tennessee paper published by the Tennessee Baptist association.<ref>See "[http://www.rootsweb.com/~tnnews/brmain.htm Baptist and Reflector]," ''rootsweb.com'' (accessed 15 December 2007). The Smoot Hearing report cites this author with his editorial title in volume 1, page 15.</ref>
| + | If you identify yourself by your political affiliation, you will instantly be categorized as having certain beliefs—though I don’t know anyone who believes everything that their preferred political party presently embraces. |
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| − | A citation generally given for Brigham Young's remarks is from the Church's English publication: "The Manifesto," ''Millennial Star'' 52 (24 Nov. 1890): 744.
| + | We could go on and on, rehearsing the constraints of various labels that we put on ourselves or that other people place upon us. ... |
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| − | However, an examination of this reference shows no sign of the quote in question—see PDF scan of the original [http://contentdm.lib.byu.edu/u?/MStar,33220 here].
| + | How tragic it is when someone believes the label another person has given them. ... |
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| − | == Later authors have continued to repeat the "quotation" from Brigham ==
| + | [Satan] rejoices in labels because they divide us and restrict the way we think about ourselves and each other. How sad it is when we honor labels more than we honor each other. |
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| − | Later authors have continued to repeat the "quotation" from Brigham, and provide the citation to the E.A. Folk's ''The Story of Mormonism'', or the ''Millenial Star'' in their footnotes. However, these authors do not seem to have verified the original. They are likely simply repeating the claim from previous authors without checking:
| + | Labels can lead to judging and animosity. Any ''abuse'' or ''prejudice'' toward another because of nationality, race, sexual orientation, gender, educational degrees, culture, or other significant identifiers is offensive to our Maker! Such mistreatment causes us to live beneath our stature as His covenant sons and daughters! |
| − | * {{CriticalWork:Abanes:One Nation|pages=281}}
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| − | * {{CriticalWork:Erickson:As a Thief in the Night|pages=chapter 8, footnote 118}}
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| − | == Since the Smoot Committee hearings "quotation" of Brigham came from an apostate Mormon, it's possible that this witness provided false testimony (either unwittingly or intentionally) ==
| + | There are various labels that may be very important to you, of course. Please do not misunderstand me. I am not saying that other designations and identifiers are not significant. I am simply saying that no identifier should ''displace'', ''replace'', or ''take priority over'' these three enduring designations: “child of God,” “child of the covenant,” and “disciple of Jesus Christ.” |
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| − | Since the Smoot Committee hearings "quotation" of Brigham came from an apostate Mormon, it's possible that this witness provided false testimony (either unwittingly or intentionally). The prestige of a U.S. Congressional document has led subsequent writers to trust this witnesses' account without verifying the source for themselves.
| + | Any identifier that is not compatible with these three basic designations will ultimately let you down. Other labels will disappoint you in time because they do not have the power to lead you toward eternal life in the celestial kingdom of God. |
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| − | <!-- PLEASE DO NOT REMOVE ANYTHING BELOW THIS LINE --> | + | Worldly identifiers will never give you a vision of who you can ultimately become. They will never affirm your divine DNA or your unlimited, divine potential.<ref>Russell M. Nelson, "Choices for Eternity," Worldwide Devotional for Young Single Adults, 15 May 2022 {[link|url=https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/broadcasts/worldwide-devotional-for-young-adults/2022/05/12nelson?lang=eng}}</ref>}} |
| − | [[Category:Questions]]
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| − | [[es:Pregunta: ¿Brigham dijo "Vamos a poner la lana sobre los ojos del pueblo estadounidense"?]]
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| − | [[Category:Questions]]
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| − | [[es:Pregunta: ¿Brigham Young declaró? "Si alguna vez llega un día en que los santos interfieren con los derechos de los demás a vivir como les parezca, puede saber con seguridad que la Iglesia ya no está dirigida por un Profeta, sino un simple hombre" ?]]
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| − | [[es:Pregunta: ¿Brigham Young dijo "Yo soy la voz de Dios y cualquiera que no le guste será derribado"?]]
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